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Monday, February 15, 2010

Tanton Cat-Ketch 43-45.



The Tanton 43 Rollon is for sale. This is not a boat project, serious enquiries only. Please contact Tanton Brokerage for information at http://www.tantonyachts@aol.com



I want to start a discussion about cat-ketch, and free standing rigs in general. A few years ago, on the bulletin board @ http://www.tantonyachts.com/, the comments made on the subject were helpful to the ones owning the T 43-45's. Especially important now as the boats gain in age. I hope we can start where we left out. I want to thank Nick Charman for his efforts in that direction. I think that a good sailing photo should be part of the start-up and I am looking forward receiving them. I know that to receive pictures is like pulling teeth out, but we will see.

24 comments:

  1. Hi all

    It would be good to get a lively forum going again. As they get older we might all be of mutual support in keeping the T43s and T45s in good condition and sailing to interesting places. They are certainly made with a build quality which should see them through, and many to my knowledge have had refits, so the owners of the re-fitted boats should have a wealth of technical wisdom among them.

    We have two about to cross the Atlantic toward Europe, and it seems that they are slowly migrating over here...before long we'll have more in Europe than the USA!!!

    Has anyone had a case of a weeping stern tube, where the weep seems to be coming from the area between the stern tube and the hull?....if so Cindy and Phil would like to know the cause and the cure...for Paddy Mac. Having her slipped right now and investigated.

    Talking about stern tubes....anyone want to know about a technique for pulling the cutless bearing, while leaving the prop-shaft in place....well I have one! Quite quick and painless .... with the right tool!

    What is obvious is that with a good mutual support forum, like all class associations, the boat will be more valuable, since there is a solid core of interest in it, and experience....and with the rig not being well known, that is important.

    Thanks for putting this together, and hosting it, Yves-Marie....lets have a lively owner's forum!! Lets put our emails to each other up in public here, rather than keep them private - there's lots of wisdom in these exchanges, which should be more widely shared.

    Happy sailing
    Nick
    Fera, Hull#22 (currently in Scotland)

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  2. Thank you Nick.
    Do we have a list of owners? Present location?
    Let's make one.
    Photos anyone?

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  3. List of owners & locations that I know of is:
    Fera - Nick and Stella Charman- Inverness Scotland
    Rollon - Phil and Liz Hughes - Roche Bernard, Brittany (France)
    Dino of Dart (T45) - Ian and Jane Barrie - Dartmouth, Devon England
    Amelia - Jon and Anne Davis - Dartmouth Devon England
    Paddy Mac - Cindy and Phil Abbott - ? N Carolina, USA (but en-route for Europe!)

    Not sure where John Winstanley and Lexow Grant are right now with their boats - but believe John is bringing it to the UK.

    With all the experience of bringing these boats to the UK - we ought to be pooling the RCD experience - where to get it done/cheapest places in Europe etc
    N

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  4. John Winstanley who is bringing Tattyanna (Hull no??) to the UK in May/June has asked me which is the best way to heave-to with these boats. As I don't know how to post an original comment on this blog site I'll put it as a comment here. I'll give my answer, but others might want to post their thoughts too.

    I found that the best way to heave to is essentially the same as on a "normal" sloop, which has a soft foresail where you use the sheet to hold it to windward. When on one tack, use a substantial strop, or handy billy to hold/pull the main onto the leeward toerail - there is a substantial fairlead in the toerail just under the clew of the main when close hauled, so set a strong strop on that fairlead, led up to the sheet shackle on the main boom, and made off taut. Now tack and the strop will stop the main tacking too - it is held up to windward, and with the wheel locked off trying to point the boat to weather, the boat effectively stops and gently slides sideways, making perhaps a knot fwds motion, and leaving a large slick to windward as she slides sideways downwind.

    Clearly you might practise this before doing it "in anger" - and I use the technique when a crew member wants to stop for some mackerel, or whatever. Might work better with a reefed main, rather than a full main, and the set of the mizzen and wheel is something to adjust til you're happy ....but it all works well. You want to arrange the heaving to strop in a way which allows you to release it under load, as the load is quite substantial, and it will be hard to tack with the strop on. You could always wear ship, which would get you the same result ...but think about releasing the strop under load!

    All best
    Nick

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  5. Hello everyone! This is Liz Hughes, S/Y Rollon, Hull no 20

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  6. Hello Nick and fellow Cat Ketch owners,

    We are C Toy, Hull #14, Greg and Barbara Klawter. We just returned to Fl. after 4 years in South and Central America. The trip was wonderful and so was C Toy. We plan on being in Fl. for a few years and possibly buying some land up in the mountains. With that in mind we are talking about selling C Toy. Slip rental in Fl. is getting very expensive so to just let her sit in the water unattended just wouldn't be right for her or us. If anyone is interested I can give you complete details of the boat. She has recieved very good care and has everything you need for extended cruising. The sails are brand new (purchased last month). She has a Caterpillar diesel,hull has been sanded down to the glass and epoxy barrier coated. We found the hull to be in perfect condition with no repairs having been done to the original hull. The masts were also sanded down checked and repainted. Rudder opened and inspected and filled with closed cell foam. She has new thru-hulls, seacocks, hoses,wiring,windlass,water tank,fuel tank, ect. ect. ect. If anyone is interested you could save 10% by making an offer before she goes to a broker. My email address is
    svctoy@yahoo.com My phone # is 772-342-8373
    Thanks Greg.

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  7. Hi Greg
    Pity - John Winstanley was bemoaning the fact that only one T43 was on the market when he just bought his. Can we see any pics, please? I do not know of anyone else in the market right now, unfortunately. Why not set up a small website with keywords "Tanton 43 yacht for sale", anyone looking will Google those words, and may find you? Sailing videos on the website? Good luck anyway. If I hear of anyone looking, I'll let you know.

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  8. I am wondering of the whereabouts of the 50' Cat-Ketch Millenium Falcon? Built out of steel with wooden deck, the boat was built in France. The last I heard she was in Mexico after rounding South America.

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    1. I tracked down Millenium Falcon in New Caledonia. I have some nice pictures of the boat.

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  9. There are presently (july 3, 2010) 3 T43 and one aluminum Cat-Ketch for sale. Also one 44 cutter. Anyone interested?

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    1. Do you know if the aluminum Cat-Ketch still on the market? (I assume you mean aluminum hull, rather than aluminum mast?)

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    2. Hello. Thank you for your comment. A quick check at Yachtworld.com (keyword search tanton) does not show the boat anymore. I'll check further

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  10. The Toucan, Hull #19, just made the trip from San Francisco to San Diego. She's doing the Baja HaHa for a third time. Last time was in 1998.

    A survey reports some cracks showing on the leading edge of the masts. Assumed to be superficial, but anyone have comments? The mast do flex quite a bit, which is part of her charm.

    Kevin

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    1. Kevin
      If you still own Toucan (a boat I sailed on once, by the way) there is a new Tanton owners facebook group that you'd be very welcome to join....see my post below.

      Just go on FB and search for Tanton 43 & 45 Owners

      Nick C

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  11. I see that this blog has become very quiet, which is a pity ( and I can be partly to blame, I guess). I want to say that I have also set up a Facebook group called Tanton 43& 45 Owners - and if you own one, please be assured you will be welcome. Idea is to have a chat space, where we can post info/pictures, comments/wisdom and otherwise.
    We know that yachts with active Owners' Associations are more easily sold and thus more valuable. Cat ketches are less than usual, so such a resource may be more than usually valuable.
    Facebook has an advantage that it will notify you when there is activity, and that may help lively discussion.
    And of course, YMT, we will be very pleased to see you as a member of that group too - I guess designing the boat gives you honorary rights, even if you don't own one!!
    Let's see how that goes....

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    1. Yes, it has been quiet. The only excuse is that it takes a lot of time to cover it all in my life. It is quite an undertaking. I do not know if you follow Sailing Anarchy. http://www.sailinganarchy.com
      Under Forums... Cruising...page 2 or 3 there is a thread about free standing rig. Maybe you can add a few comments.
      I am leary about Facebook.

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  12. Hans and Gisela Bacher sold the T.43 Tunnix. After 30 years of part time cruising all over, they stepped up ashore on Palma,in Spain. I had the pleasure to sail with them in Antigua many moons ago.

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    1. Someone interested in a 43 sent me the following found on the Internet. I presume the text is from C.C of Offshore Yachts, son of the main importer of the T.43 in the 80's. Because it is elogious I reserve my own impression, but I leave open the discussion to counter, agree or dismiss the text.
      " My Dad built all of these boats, I installed all the masts and rigging and delivered lots of them, many times all up and down the East Coast, and took them in a lot of races too. We won the Bermuda Race (Charleston to Bermuda edited by ymt). They are fantastic. The easiest rig to handle, bar none. You can definitely run the reef lines into the cockpit and rig lazy jacks under the wishbones,(like this one. I suppose that he was responding to someone questions. edit.ymt), and do all the reefing without leaving the cockpit. You tack or gybe just by turning the wheel. I have done gybes all standing in 30-40 kts of wind, like butter because the wishbone acts as a shock absorber. I have tacked up narrow chanels, even through a drawbridge singlehanded with a broken down engine, no problem. I have sailed backwards off a grounding with no engine. The boat is perfectly balanced and will steer herself upwind with just the wheel brake on for miles and miles without having to move the wheel. The rig is so strong and foolproof it is the best thing about it. You only need to check the deck partners and the mast step, rather than 18 or 20 turnbuckles, clevis and cotter pins which are all potential failure points. The rig is so light it improves the stiffnss and lack of pitching, plus allows the boat to get away with only five foot draft but sail upwind right with the full race boats. Downwind, she really hits her pace and you can pass boats flying chutes and trimming in a frenzy while seeping a beer, and steering with your foot. This was one of the most seaworthy boats I have ever been on, and I have been on a lot. While fast and fairly light, she is built like a tank. One of them broke loose in a hurricane and surged about Ipswich harbor and sank four other boats while suffering minimal damage. I had various ones, through several gales up to 100kts and 20 foot waves with not trouble at all. Plus this particular one has the teak decks which were an option and are a major improvement in my opinion. Hopefully this boat is hull number 6, which for some reason was the fastes one, I had her hit 18.6 knots as the all time top speed, surfing down a big wave."

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    2. Hi Are you Al Constantine's son? Do you remember Wind Whistler and know where it is? robjay57@aol.com

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  13. The 50' Millemium falcon sold in Nouvelle Caledonia. Gerard Saint Jalmes and his wife put 32000 miles of ocean behind them.

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    1. I have finally some news about Gerard. Sorry about the text in French, but I want to reproduce what he said with integrity. If translated, I am sure you can get the drift.
      "Bonjour, je me souviens que vous m'avez dit avoir du mal a obtenir des nouvelles des bateaux que vous avez dessine...Maintenant je sais pourquoi. De l'eau a coule sous les ponts, alors je peux vous dire ce qu'il en est.
      C'est un tres bon bateau, j'ai fait a son bord 32000 milles entre 55 sud et 53 nord, a deux ou en solo, il est comfortable et sur, le gros temps commence a 50 kts. Parlons technique: il faut 3 domaines de competences differents pour faire un bateau.
      Connaitre les calculs de structures, la reglementation, le dessin industriel, la mecanique des fluides etc... c'est votre partie, aucun probleme.
      Connaitre la mer en navigation, pas en reves, c'est mon domaine, pas de problemes non plus.
      Connaitre le travail de chantier: la, probleme, j'ai du faire des modif.
      -Une coque avec des couples non fermes(barrots en bois)est impossible a transporter et a retourner en fin de chaudronnerie; j'ai donc ferme les couples avec des barrots acier en "T", le pont CP est colle et boulonne comme la liaison coque-pont. Le procede semi forme est.. une coque en forme, il faut une cintreuse a olives...j'ai redessine la coque avec 3 bouchains, pour ne pas trop modifier la carene,apres coup, j'aurais pu n'en faire que deux.
      Un flettner sur safran ne fonctionne que sur un safran NON compense, j'aurai du reviser mes cours d'aerodynamique. je l'ai supprime, et monte un pilote hydraulique, il a toujours tenu le cap parfaitemnt, regle au minimum de gain a tel point que j'ai renonce a m'equiper d'un deuxieme pilote. Au pres, ce qui marche le mieux est pilote sur stand by, la barre hydraulique etant irreversible permet de regler le neutre fonction des conditions. L'excellente stabilite de route est une des qualites majeures du bateau, ainsi que sa capacite a avancer et tenir son cap des 5 kts de vent. Vitesse max atteinte, une fois pour voire; 17 kts; aucun interet, en mer il faut durer.
      Voilure: j'ai reduit les mats de 22 m a 18.10 m et 16.5 m pour l'artimon, deja pour avoir le centre de voilure devant le centre de derive, malgre cela, je devais ariser des 15 kts, beaucoup trop de puissance, une coque fine n'a pas besoin de toute cette puissance, surtout avec une helice a mise en drapeau et rien d'inutile qui traine en dessous. En prenant un ris sous un grain en face de Angra dos reis, la latte du bas, qui devait faire 5.50 metres, a perce la toile et a disparu a la mer, j'ai retaille la voile sur une plage de Patagonie avec un creux de chute de 2%..super. Hisser et ariser va tout seul, avec un fort rond de chute, les ris ne sont jamais assez haut et ca pousse contre le mat. Depuis toutes mes voiles sont sans lattes avec un creux de chute. Une petite acceleration de vent ne m'oblige plus a sonner le branle bas.
      J'ai reduit les longueurs de mat sans toucher les sections, en remontant la cote Chilienne, cote Pacifique on s'est fait retourner. Le vent souflait a 40 kts, on avait 10m carre a l'artimon, grand mat a sec de toile. La mer etait beaucoup plus forte que le vent avec de grosses deferlantes, le bateau avancait a 8 kts sur la pente des vagues. On a pris une premiere deferlante par l'arriere qui a submerge le pont puis une autre 3/4 arriere, et le bateau s'est mis en travers et a roule, on a eu la chance que la deferlante tape sur le dessous de la coque et pas sur le pont il s'est redresse du cote ou il etait parti, pas de tour complet donc. Les mats sont toujours la.

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    2. Ctd. Millenium Falcon.
      Quille: ayant modifie la voilure, j'ai reduit le tirant d'eau a 2.25 m. J'ai construit un profile NACA 6012 ( pour pouvoir rentrer et souder dedans). 800kgs d'acier, 3 tonnes de plomb de 2.25 a 1.80 metres, 500 litres d'eau et 750 litres de gasoil, 5 tonnes en tout. La gite est de 17 degres. Entre la mer de Cortez et Juan de Fuca Strait, on a fait 10 jours continus au pres: tres vivable.
      Modif mineures: on n'est jamais face au vent en voilier, une casquette qui ne protege pas les cotes n'a pas d'interet, j'ai vitre les cotes. J'ai rentre dans la cabine arriere deux sommiers a lattes de 80 cm de large qui forment un lit double de 1.65 par 2 m, utilisable seulement en solo en mer, les parois des coffres de chaque cote servent de toile de roulis.
      Defauts du bateau: le fardage est sur l'avant, a cause de l'implantation des mats, il tire fort d'un bord sur l'autre a l'ancre, j'ai arrange ca avec une ancre de 110 lbs. 60 metres de chaine de 12 mm et un triangle de 5 m carre en tape cul. En mer sans erre et a sec de toile, il se met vent arriere, inhabituel mais tres pratique et confortable. La prise de corps mort se fait en marche arriere, le bateau reste stable, et la plate forme proche d el'eau facilite enormement le travail compare a l'etrave haute. Sur 30 000 milles, on a fait une moyenne de 6.6 knots avec 7% au moteur. Si on exclut le passage en Patagonie par le detroit de Magellan, ou on a fait beaucoup de moteur contre le vent et le courant, la moyenne est la meme mais avec 4% au moteur. le 750 litres de gasoil donnent 1000 milles d'autonomie. 800 milles sur le fond en Patagonie, ou on a du faire un crochet par Puerto Natales pour refueler. On n'a pratiquement jamais fait une journees a moinds de 100 milles, on a toujours limite la vitesse en dessous des 10 kts pour eviter le bruit de train, la casse, et l'epuisement de l'equipage.
      Ma femme et moi sommes installes en Nouvelle caledonie, j'ai retape une maison, construit un autre bateau, un Panga de 20 ft sur remorque pour le coup de peche, et je commence la construction d'un ULM.
      Pas de projet hauturier pour l'instant.
      Note from ymt: 2 points of interest for me: getting rid of the full battens and keeping the boat under 10 knots. That is different.

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  14. New Tanton Brokerage Listing.
    A T45 is for sale in South Florida. For information please e-mail me at: tantonyachts@aol.com
    One of the 5 built, only 2 owners, cosmetics to be addressed but otherwise almost ready to go.

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  15. 7/27/17
    Sale pending for the above T45.

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